Dwarf Fortress Wiki - User contributions [en]

40d Talk:Mega construction

2008-11-10T17:53:23Z

DanielLC: Other Mega constructions

The example diagrams for building a tower only work if you have a 'floor' (ie, walls from below) at the same width as the tower floor you are building - if you are trying to make a larger room above a smaller one, scaffolding (i prefer floors) will need to be appended to build the corners, because you cannot build a wall diagonally. Having built an inverted pyramid, this is a mildly annoying building concern, and the diagram should reflect the presence of a wall below where you are building. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 19:50, 12 May 2008 (EDT)

It should probably also be noted on this page that you can hang up stairs off a ledge, but not downstairs, which means building down (without carving stairs into something) is hard. This would really only come up if you were trying to build something above and going down towards (or going down into!) a lake, ocean, lava pool, or sufficiently wide chasm, and avoidable in some of those cases. (Yes, I am trying to build down through ocean right now). --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 19:50, 12 May 2008 (EDT)

== Tower Guide Showdown ==

The first section of this page duplicates my [[tower guide]]. I know I'm pimping my pages here, but perhaps a link there would make more sense.

Honestly, I think my version is better. --[[User:Strangething|Strangething]] 15:15, 19 August 2008 (EDT)

:I think merging the tower page into this one would be a good idea. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 11:01, 20 August 2008 (EDT)
:Oh, it seems there has already been talk about this on [[talk:tower guide]]. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 11:02, 20 August 2008 (EDT)

== 3x3 towers ==

3x3 towers are more or less worthless, I'll admit, but they're really simple to build. A diagram, each block is a different Z level:

<pre>
-----
|000|
| X |
|000|
-----
|0 0|
|0X0|
|0 0|
-----
|000|
| X |
|000|
-----

Legend: O= wall, X= up/down staircase
</pre>

Lather, rinse, repeat. Just alternate the two lines of walls, then fill in the gaps when complete. I'm probably not the first one to think of it, but I haven't seen it anywhere. The walls give floors to allow dwarves to stand on during construction. They're useful for buildig guard towers with fortifications (may spread out at top), or an escape route, but not too much else, I'll admit. I use both up and down staircases because at the bottom level you can include storage for supplies for guards, or additional water storage/drainage.

Feel free to delete if it's not appropriate, I don't care.

[[User:Erathoniel|Erathoniel]] 22:08, 12 October 2008 (EDT)

== Other Mega constructions ==

At the time of this writing, the article begins:<blockquote>There comes a time in every dwarfs life when he says to himself- why not? Be it magma waterfalls, huge castles, skyscrapers, great cathedrals, you can build anything!</blockquote>Then is goes on to explain how to build towers, and just towers, as if that's the only mega construction. This should be put back into a tower guide page. You can't have much of a guide for how to build mega constructions, aside from a few general tips, as they're so varied. I suggest redoing the article, and having it give general ideas for what to do, along with general tips of how to do it, and maybe a few different pictures of completed mega constructions. [[User:DanielLC|DanielLC]] 12:53, 10 November 2008 (EST)

40d:Restraint

2008-11-10T17:20:21Z

DanielLC:

A '''restraint''' is a [[chain]] or [[rope]] which is used to restrain a [[dwarf]] or other [[creature]]. Unlike the [[cage]], the restraint can only hold one creature, and the creature can move within a range of one tile of the restraint in all directions. In a previous version it could move up and down through solid floors; it is unknown whether this is currently the case. Also unlike cages, restrained animals can breed.

Restraints can be used to keep a [[war dog]] or other animal near areas where you need constant vigilance and defense. Chained dogs placed near the entrance to your fort will catch [[kobold]] thieves that can bypass traps and other passive defenses.

If your fortress is above ground, or exists in a location without [[rock]], [[rope]]s or [[bags]] sewn with [[image]]s can be a way of recording your fortress' history instead of [[stone detailing]]. When built as restraints (or [[container]]s, for bags), dwarves can admire them, so they can function as makeshift tapestries.

{{Buildings}}
[[Category:Furniture]][[Category:Verify]]

40d:Restraint

2008-11-10T17:20:06Z

DanielLC:

40d:Restraint

2008-11-10T17:19:53Z

DanielLC:

Dwarf Fortress Wiki talk:Community Portal

2008-10-31T03:39:41Z

DanielLC: /* Pictures */

Use this discussion page to talk about any issues or ideas you have about the direction of this wiki. The community portal is a hub for directing our conciousness. Read the rules carefully, take them to heart, post here if you have any questions or you think the rules can be improved.

==Account Problems==
I can't log in, but it says my username is already in use. --[[User:64.22.68.4|64.22.68.4]] 14:55, 29 October 2007 (EDT) (Peristarkawan)
:Are you sure? The new wiki cleaned out all the old accounts so you have to reregister. --[[User:Hamelin|Hamelin]] 15:02, 29 October 2007 (EDT)
::Unfortunately, I was unable to import all the user accounts, please recreate. --[[User:Senso|Senso]] 15:22, 29 October 2007 (EDT)

==AdBlock==
Could you move all the files in the graphics directory with the word "ad" in it? For those using AdBlock or similar add-ons it will block the display of the graphics in those directories. Thanks!!! :) [[User:Schm0|Schm0]] 10:26, 5 November 2007 (EST)
:It doesn't look possible - re-uploading the file keeps putting it in the 'ad' folder and I cannot edit the link in the DB as it is stored inside a BLOB. I suggest you whitelist this site anyways, it's not like you need to block anything here (and blocking /*ad*/ may cause problems elsewhere too). --[[User:Senso|Senso]] 10:49, 5 November 2007 (EST)

== Rule discussion ==

Z is pretty horrible, but not much point taking it out unless its to replace it with something better. (This whole setup is horrible, but that's irrelevant?) --[[User:Jackard|Jackard]] 21:23, 16 February 2008 (EST)

=== A ===

How do we handle several rules that starts with the same character? I see that '''titles''' have been moved to '''page titles''' because of '''timelessness'''. But what about other scenarios that doesnt have an solution as easy? --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 07:51, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:We can handle them as they come up. In general, I think it's better practice to avoid reusing letters than to have to rename an existing rule.

:If we want to just do away with rule '''A''' at this point, that would be fine. It was only meant to be a starting point for brainstorming, and the rules haven't changed much lately. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 11:21, 5 November 2007 (EST)

::I Call for Judgment on this statement, this would remove the backbone rule used to define this alphabetical set of rules. We could put it outside of the rules though, like a description. --[[User:Senso|Senso]] 12:24, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:::Unless we have another rule that must start with A, why not keep it? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 12:28, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:::I like rule A, it introduces the page, please keep it --[[User:Markavian|Markavian]] 16:32, 13 November 2007 (EST)

=== B and E ===

How are B and E ''rules''? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 11:27, 7 November 2007 (EST)

:Rules? I thought the alphabet was the guide for the war against entropy [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 11:34, 7 November 2007 (EST)

::Well, the Alphabet rule does describe them as rules. But I don't really think that B and E seem out of place. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 11:37, 7 November 2007 (EST)

:They will simply be replaced by "real" rules once someone have made them. --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 14:23, 7 November 2007 (EST)

:I think of them more as "guidelines" ;) [[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 20:22, 7 November 2007 (EST)

:I put strikes through B and E and wrote more helpful ones (along the same lines) --Me
:Gravitas was a silly word. What do you think of the new rules? --[[User:Markavian|Markavian]]

:The be bold rule makes it's dramatic return! Victory! [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 19:39, 24 March 2008 (EDT)

=== Serious Rules ===

Would it be possible for us to come up with some *real* rules that are more ... serious? --[[User:Geofferic|Geofferic]] 08:59, 10 December 2007 (EST)

:The alphabet rules concept is senseless. Maybe remove the fluff? --[[User:Jackard|Jackard]] 11:09, 10 December 2007 (EST)

::Hey now, with a couple of exceptions, the rules are serious. The point of the alphabet framework wasn't random silliness; it was to inspire creativity and make rule-writing fun. It's hard to come up with good rules out of thin air. It's easier to think up a topic of concern that starts with a particular letter and then write a rule about it.

::Of course, the rules have been pretty stable for a while now, so rule A hasn't been too useful lately. There was a brief discussion a while back about dropping rule A under [[DwarfFortressWiki:Community Portal#Rule discussion]], and everybody seemed to want to keep it at the time. If you want to reopen that discussion, then I'm okay with either keeping it or dropping it (besides which, I haven't been too active around here lately anyway). --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 11:54, 10 December 2007 (EST)

:::I support the Alphabet ruleset, I don't see why it should change. It's clean and clear. --[[User:Senso|Senso]] 16:56, 10 December 2007 (EST)

::::It's childish, incomplete, unprofessional and silly. The rules are not grouped logically and there is no table of contents. There's not room for clarification or expounding and little opportunity to expand. It should be scrapped for something that makes sense. --[[User:Geofferic|Geofferic]] 03:25, 12 December 2007 (EST)

:::::It would be trivial to change it from an unordered list to use section headings, which would allow a table of contents and plenty of room for clarification. I don't think "little opportunity to expand" is valid; there's no reason we can't have multiple rules for the same letter, or rules that fall outside the alphabet rubric entirely.

:::::If you want to improve the organization, then just go for it. Let me suggest that you create the new version on a subpage at first, so that others can view two presentations side by side when discussing it. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 12:06, 12 December 2007 (EST)

:::::While I agree with some of your points, I'd like to say that this is not a "professional" wiki and silliness in general is a good thing. This is a wiki (Internet!) about a game (Haha!) that is pretty silly itself. If you want to create a Whole Complex and Indexed Body of Rules About Everything, go for it and as [[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] said, editors should be able to choose between the two. I just don't see the need. --[[User:Senso|Senso]] 14:47, 12 December 2007 (EST)

=== Ack! The ToC! The ToC with a "1.26"! ===

...why do we need section headers for each of the rules? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:52, 28 May 2008 (EDT)
:I've fixed the TOC. [[User:Random832|Random832]] 17:17, 14 October 2008 (EDT)

=== W ===

Word-of-mouth: If you hear someone saying something new about the game, don't post it without trying it out yourself. You might have misunderstood something or your friend might have expressed him/herself wrongly. 
Something like that.--[[User:Karpatius|Karppa]] 10:33, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

:That goes in the "Rule discussion" section. *ka-move* Also, remember to not put blank lines in a comment by a single user.</offtopic>
:I don't like the rule. It discourages participation in the wiki. If they add something of questionable merit, they're supposed to use the verify template, as stated in rule V. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 11:39, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

::Will remember that in the future.
::--[[User:Karpatius|Karppa]] 02:16, 4 June 2008 (EDT)

=== W 2 ===

There are no rules about humorous content yet. I notice that references to the '''Dwarf pensioners club''' instead of '''(fortress) Guard''' have been taken out of "fact-based" articles so maybe rule W could be:

:'''Wit''' can be hard to recognise once it has been written down. It is best if it is used on clearly humour or story related pages, talk or user pages, but kept to a minimum in fact-based articles like [[Dwarf]] or [[Summer]].

This puts it "on the table" that your humour is appreciated in certain places but not in every article you contribute to. I'm not happy with my own wording but I think the intent should be there somewhere.

It could go at '''Zany''' instead because Z will be harder letter to use up!
(having said all that I personally don't object to "well done" humour even in straight-cut articles like [[Screw pump]] - the issue is my humour is incomprehensible to a lot of people and can just sound rude!)
[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 02:51, 6 July 2008 (EDT)

:I like it as '''Wit'''. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 15:09, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

::With no against comments I put in in there with a reference to {{tl|D for Dwarf}}.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 01:01, 12 July 2008 (EDT)

== Enforcing consistency in screenshots? ==

Can I strongly suggest that all screenshots be taken with the default interface and tileset, for consistency's sake? It seems to me like that would be a good way of keeping the wiki aesthetics constant. [[User:EighenIndemnis|EighenIndemnis]] 11:33, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:We can make it a rule, but we shouldn't remove any screenshots for non-conformance (except to replace them with conforming screenshots). --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 11:46, 5 November 2007 (EST)

::Yeah, for some tutorials that are written while the user is playing, it would be impossible to anyway. [[User:EighenIndemnis|EighenIndemnis]] 11:47, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:::I agree that images should use the default tileset for articles, but I disagree for personal pages or bloodline games. --[[User:Markavian|Markavian]]

::::The rule as written already exempts bloodline games. The only rule that should apply to personal pages is '''D'''. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 16:05, 5 November 2007 (EST)

Um, I added the rule before noticing the discussion here. Anyway, I added rule '''I''', inspired by the old [[Water wheel]] image ([[:Image:PerpetualMotion.JPG]]), which was incomprehesible to me and unnecessarily large. Like Peristarkawan said, the exemption of user pages is implied, but feel free to make it explicit if you want. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 16:13, 5 November 2007 (EST)

How about this?

[[Image:World_creation_screen2.png | none | frame | 400px | World creation screenshot.]]

It's clean, neat and doesn't warp the page. :) The obvious drawback is file size is not monitored. Can't we edit the file upload settings to measure pixels? Nothing over 800x600? [[User:Schm0|Schm0]] 19:16, 7 November 2007 (EST)

== Redirects and article titles ==

How do you do that thing that makes a certain term redirect to a different page? Like [[Elephants]] redirecting to [[Elephant]], for example. --[[User:BahamutZERO|BahamutZERO]] 15:20, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

:If [[Elephants]] already exists, you can move the page to [[Elephant]], and it will create the redirect for you. Otherwise, just edit [[Elephants]] to read: <nowiki>#REDIRECT [[Elephant]]</nowiki> --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 15:26, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

::I see, thanks! --[[User:BahamutZERO|BahamutZERO]] 15:27, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

:::Just FYI, if at all possible, ''do not create pages as plurals''. Use the following syntax: <nowiki>[[Elephant]]s</nowiki>: example [[Elephant]]s. --[[User:JT|JT]] 20:20, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

What about titles that are verbs? Should they be in "base-form"? Or whatever its called (my english on this level isnt the best). Example: should the title be '''Mine''' or '''Mining'''? --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 17:30, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

:Based on the Wikipedia style, titles should be nouns. So in your example it should be the gerund '''Mining''', and '''Mine''' would be the title for an article about mines. I've updated the rule to reflect this. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 17:35, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

::What about skills and professions? Should we have a '''Bone carving''' (labor preference) article and a '''Bone carver''' (skill) article, or would this be redundant? I've seen both styles linked to, but tend to think that the -ing form should redirect to the -er form. Opinions? --[[User:Mechturk|Mechturk]] 03:11, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:::Sounds good to me. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 11:21, 5 November 2007 (EST)

Btw, shouldnt all these comments be moved into [[DwarfFortressWiki talk:Community Portal|talk]]? --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 17:30, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

:Moved the account problem comments to the talk page. The rest are informative. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 13:26, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

== Tutorials ==

New players are getting bogged down by the complexity at the start of their fortresses, I think we should get some "getting started" or "surviving your first winter" type tutorials up as soon as possible. --[[User:BahamutZERO|BahamutZERO]] 16:33, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

:[[Your first fortress]] will do just that. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 11:31, 2 November 2007 (EDT) 

== Categories ==

I saw that the category [[:category:buildings]] had been added to category [[:category:world]]. I started to look for categories without parents and adding them to world to sortof have a list of every category. Is this good thinking? --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 19:19, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

:We already have a list of all categories at [[Special:Categories]], although it does include a few categories that aren't directly related to the game.
:Based upon the description of [[:Category:World]], it seems to me that most of the things that are currently in it don't really belong there. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 19:27, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

::Ok, Ill remove them from [[:category:world]]. But how often is [[Special:Categories]] updated? I dont see [[:category:furnaces]] in there. --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 20:24, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

:::[[Special:Categories]] is automatically updated by the Wiki software as soon as it detects a change. However, MediaWikis aggressively cache pages. It's also possible you're looking a client-side cached page of it. Finally, I don't see any content in that category so it's possible it's being ignored. See [[Special:Unusedcategories]] instead. --[[User:JT|JT]] 20:28, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

== Deletion ==

We now have a [[:category:deletion]], who has the power to delete pages? When are they deleted? Who make the final call? The same person that deletes them? What rules should we make regarding this? --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 11:57, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

:Anyone can mark a page for deletion using the <nowiki>{{del}}</nowiki> tag, however it is usually recommended to get a consensus that it's not worth keeping. Exceptions are things like spam or empty pages. The <nowiki>{{del}}</nowiki> tag just lets the admin know to delete it, ultimately it's his call to do so or not. Just ask around on the talk page first, if no one disagrees, add the tag. (Disclaimer: that's how it worked on the old wiki, the policy may change as this new wiki grows.) --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 13:02, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

== Water level style ==

I think we should have a standard style for talking about water level. We could say it various ways, such as "6/7 water," "water with a depth of 6," "a depth of 6 pool," or "water with a depth of six." It seems using the numeral makes it clear that we mean water depth, without adding the /7. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 13:02, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

:I'm not sure. The /7 is definately unnessessary and that we should use 6 instead of six, maybe create a template to make the numberal blue/red (water/magma)? If not "Water 6" and "Magma 5" seem short, simple, correct, and understandable.--[[User:Draco18s|Draco18s]] 03:27, 2 November 2007 (EDT)

::Like {{Raw Tile|6|#44F|#009}} / {{Raw Tile|6|#F44|#900}} or {{Raw Tile|6|#00F|#000}} / {{Raw Tile|6|#F00|#000}}? --[[User:Matryx|Matryx]] 05:38, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:::Too hard to read against the normal white background I think. But just the coloured number on its own would stand out weirdly. --[[User:Shades|Shades]] 06:10, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:::: {{Raw Tile|6|#00F|#FFF}} / {{Raw Tile|6|#F00|#FFF}} or not even going so far as to use the tile template? --[[User:Matryx|Matryx]] 06:16, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:I think "depth of 7" works wonders, bold, colored text had a bit high contrast according to my taste. In case there is either magma or water, just state it. And we should also link to a waterdepth article for those that are in need of furher explanation of the concept. Example; "a water wheel needs to be placed in flowing [[water]] with a [[water depth|depth]] of at least 3". --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 07:44, 5 November 2007 (EST)

== Templates? ==

Is there a page with a list of all the templates available to us? Are all of the templates migrated from the old wiki? --[[User:Felix the Cat|Felix the Cat]] 00:51, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

:You can find a list at [[Special:Allpages?namespace=10]]. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 01:44, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

== Forum references ==

Where there is a bit saying "Toady said this", what is the best way to link to the forum? Currently in magma, I've got a link to http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=001504 which shows up as [http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=001504] (not ''too'' bad). Is there a better way of doing it akin to Wikipedia with <ref>something</ref>? Maybe something like [[Template:version]] for future (but that doesn't cover the "this is how it works now" type thing. --[[User:Shagie|Shagie]] 02:17, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

: IIRC the <ref> system on Wikipedia requires an extension to be installed. --[[User:Rick|Rick]] 17:48, 7 November 2007 (EST)
::I know this is late but try this:
::<nowiki>[http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=001504 Caption]</nowiki>
::which shows as
::[http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=001504 Caption]
::I would use it like this:
:::"According to a [http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=001504 forum post]..."
::[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 02:41, 6 July 2008 (EDT)

Links of this form fail - is this forum totally gone/replaced, or can the links somehow be translated to the current forum? [[User:Random832|Random832]] 17:23, 14 October 2008 (EDT)

== Crops categories ==

My wiki-fu is weak, but surely there is a better way to present the myriad crops than having a different category for each season and biome? [[:Category:Crops]] could at least show the seasons grouped seperate from the biomes. Are we going to put each plant in its respective biome and seasons, ''and'' in [[:Category:Crops]], or is [[List of crops]] sufficient? Just seems like there's a lot of potential for a mess here, and we need to standardize the plant pages and various categories.

Personally I like the way the old wiki did it, with some nice templates. Granted there are a lot more plants in this version, but not so much that we need 20 subcategories cluttering up the crops category. See [http://archive.dwarffortresswiki.net/index.php/Crops Crops] and [http://archive.dwarffortresswiki.net/index.php/Plump_Helmets Plump Helmets]; easy to tell what crops belong in what season. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 02:52, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

== Wealth page... ==

I've been looking for tips on building fortress wealth, and haven't really been able to find anything. Can someone who knows something about it start a [[Wealth]] page? I know that mining out areas, making things, and artifacts contribute to wealth, but that's all I know. How much does mining a square contribute? Are there other ways to build wealth? Do mined out areas have to be populated, or can I go mine away a random hill and have it count? What are the best things to make to increase value? Do items have to be placed, or just made? and so on... --[[User:Bobson|Bobson]] 16:22, 11 March 2008 (EDT)

== Formatting standards ==

=== Category tags ===

On this wiki, the standard for capitalization in category tags is <tt><nowiki>[[Category:Stub]]</nowiki></tt>. I asked what it should be, and nobody answered for two and a half months, so I feel entitled to decide it. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 12:57, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

=== Headers ===

At the current time, the standard for a header is <code>=== Headers ===</code>. <code>===Headers===</code> is slightly easier to type, is typed more often by newbies, and works just as well, but has less white space. Input? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 12:57, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

:I like <code>=== Header ===</code> better, because it's easier to read, and the extra whitespace helps call your attention to the name of the section, whereas you might glance over it as an "unrecognized token" if you didn't manage to filter out the immediately surrounding markup. I think the 2 bytes saved on whitespace is negligible and I certainly don't mind correcting them when I find 'em, if necessary. A similar question (if it's not been asked) would be whether or not to include a newline in between a heading and its text. I think for big sections of text, an extra line looks nice, but for multiple, smaller, less important sections, it's easier to manage the headings if there's no blank line separating them from the section they head. --[[User:Marble Dice|Marble Dice]] 14:18, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

::I always put a blank line above and below a header (unless it's the first line in the page), except in rare situations, like the current List of Twenty-Six Rules. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 16:40, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

=== Talk pages ===

The current standard seems to be to never put a blank line in a comment by a single users, except in highly lengthy comments, and to always put exactly one blank line between comments by different users, because that's what I say in [[Template:Newbie]], but is that correct? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 16:40, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

== Italian Wiki ==

Hi! 
I've just ask to Tarn to open an italian guide on this wiki.. so can i do it? --[[User:Marte]]

:No, this wiki is english only. You're free, however, to make an Italian DF wiki... I'm not sure how that works, though, so don't ask me. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:29, 11 August 2008 (EDT)

i need an answer about this.. who can help me?

== Wikprojects ==

Do we have wikiprojects like Wikipedia? I want to start one on making sure answers to the [http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=ff2b3eb60775033d8509fa42a227db08&board=7.0 DF gameplay questions] in the forum are in the wiki. [[User:DanielLC|DanielLC]] 15:18, 4 October 2008 (EDT)

== footnotes ==

Before Wikipedia had <ref>, there were some templates they used to get about the same effect with a little more awkwardness - I can find them and get it working here if anyone wants. [[User:Random832|Random832]] 13:11, 15 October 2008 (EDT)

== Pictures ==

How about RL pictures of things like minerals, etc, that people may not be able to easily visualize? [[User:Random832|Random832]] 00:09, 30 October 2008 (EDT)

:I agree. Can someone edit [[Template:Stone layer]] to allow pictures of the actual stone? I'd be happy to contribute pictures after that. I suggest using the pictures on [http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Main_Page Wikimedia Commons]. [[User:DanielLC|DanielLC]] 23:39, 30 October 2008 (EDT)

40d:Bridge

2008-10-19T16:16:30Z

DanielLC: /* Drawbridges and retracting bridges */

A '''bridge''' is a building (not a construction) that spans multiple tiles allowing [[dwarves]] to go across [[water]], [[magma]], and other obstructions. Bridges are built from the {{k|b}}uild menu, under brid{{k|g}}e.

A bridge defaults to a single tile in size. You'll need to change the size to suit your needs; the bridge's dimensions can be set anywhere up to a square 10 tile on a side. A bridge will require both [[architecture]] and [[masonry]] (or [[carpentry]] or [[metalsmithing]] if [[wood]] or [[metal]] is used) to complete. The material required for a bridge is less than the material required for building an equivalent area of [[floor]] tiles, and when a bridge is deconstructed the materials are deposited on the ground next to where the bridge stood rather than falling down into the open space it spanned.

Unlike raising bridges, which require an area of solid ground, retractable bridges can be built using existing bridges as their sole means of support.

== Drawbridges and retracting bridges ==

A bridge can be connected to a [[lever]] or [[pressure plate]] to become a drawbridge or retracting bridge. When the lever is pulled, they will raise or retract in a direction specified at construction. The direction that a bridge raises can be slightly confusing: if a drawbridge raises to the left, then it forms a wall on the left side when raised. A drawbridge that raises requires a [[floor]] underneath the side towards which it will raise (on the tiles where the "[[wall]]" will form when raised); remember to take this into account when digging.

Anything under a drawbridge when it is lowered will be utterly killed/destroyed, including all equipment. That's why drawbridge is called ''the [[Dwarven_Atom_Smasher|dwarven atom-smasher]]''. Any objects or [[creatures]] on a drawbridge when it is raised will be flung several tiles and stunned or injured. Anything on the section of the bridge that forms a wall as it raises is crushed. Some players may consider the crushing ability of a drawbridge to be an [[exploit]] if deliberately used.

A retracting bridge is less vicious; when retracted, any object or creature on the bridge will plummet if there is a pit beneath. When extended, the bridge causes no harm to anyone in its path.

The delay between the time a [[lever]] is pulled and the time a connected bridge changes state is 100 steps.

[[Category:Constructions]]
[[Category:Buildings]]

40d Talk:Restraint

2008-10-15T01:11:12Z

DanielLC: /* Are Restraints Destructable? */

How do you make ropes in the latest version?

You make ropes from Cloth(or silk) at a Clothier's Workshop. Once you've made a Rope, you build it as a Restraint from the building menu (b)->(v) --[[User:Wahnsinniger|Wahnsinniger]] 12:30, 19 November 2007 (EST)

== Are Restraints Destructable? ==

It appears that ropes can be broken by prisoners. I think I've seen this 2-3 times, but I'd like someone else to verify -- [[User:SammyJ|SammyJ]]

:My prisoners usually destroy nearby ropes when they tantrum and there were a few occasions when they became free without damaging any ropes. Not sure if they are able to destroy their rope.--[[User:Another|Another]] 17:35, 20 November 2007 (EST)
::Did you try with something metallic, like chains? --[[User:Eagle of Fire|Eagle of Fire]] 17:58, 20 November 2007 (EST)
:I've had a war dog escape a rope. The rope wasn't damaged, and I just tied him back on.

== Breeding + Restraints ==

Do animals assigned to retraints breed normally? I know they don't breed while in cages. This info should be added here. --[[User:Felix the Cat|Felix the Cat]] 17:51, 18 July 2008 (EDT)
:They indeed do, I one of my roped war dogs sentries has a cloud of puppies around her. [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 15:13, 2 October 2008 (EDT)

40d:Rock salt

2008-10-12T19:37:32Z

DanielLC:

{{Stone_layer|name=Rock Salt|tile=#|color=#FFF|basic_color=#FFF|color2=#CCC
|uses cheese

|properties=
* [[Sedimentary layer]]
* [[Material value]] 1
|contains=
{{list|sedimentary ore}}
* Borax
* Sylvite {{list|sedimentary stone}}
'''Ornamental gems'''
{{list|sedimentary ornamental gem}}
'''Semi-Precious gems'''
{{list|sedimentary semi-precious gem}}}}

'''Rock Salt''' is a [[Sedimentary layer]]. It can contain large clusters of [[Magnetite]] as well as veins of [[Bituminous coal]].

[[Category:Stone]]
[[Category:Sedimentary Stone Layers]]

Dwarf Fortress Wiki talk:Community Portal

2008-10-04T19:18:55Z

DanielLC: Wikprojects

Use this discussion page to talk about any issues or ideas you have about the direction of this wiki. The community portal is a hub for directing our conciousness. Read the rules carefully, take them to heart, post here if you have any questions or you think the rules can be improved.

==Account Problems==
I can't log in, but it says my username is already in use. --[[User:64.22.68.4|64.22.68.4]] 14:55, 29 October 2007 (EDT) (Peristarkawan)
:Are you sure? The new wiki cleaned out all the old accounts so you have to reregister. --[[User:Hamelin|Hamelin]] 15:02, 29 October 2007 (EDT)
::Unfortunately, I was unable to import all the user accounts, please recreate. --[[User:Senso|Senso]] 15:22, 29 October 2007 (EDT)

==AdBlock==
Could you move all the files in the graphics directory with the word "ad" in it? For those using AdBlock or similar add-ons it will block the display of the graphics in those directories. Thanks!!! :) [[User:Schm0|Schm0]] 10:26, 5 November 2007 (EST)
:It doesn't look possible - re-uploading the file keeps putting it in the 'ad' folder and I cannot edit the link in the DB as it is stored inside a BLOB. I suggest you whitelist this site anyways, it's not like you need to block anything here (and blocking /*ad*/ may cause problems elsewhere too). --[[User:Senso|Senso]] 10:49, 5 November 2007 (EST)

== Rule discussion ==

Z is pretty horrible, but not much point taking it out unless its to replace it with something better. (This whole setup is horrible, but that's irrelevant?) --[[User:Jackard|Jackard]] 21:23, 16 February 2008 (EST)

=== A ===

How do we handle several rules that starts with the same character? I see that '''titles''' have been moved to '''page titles''' because of '''timelessness'''. But what about other scenarios that doesnt have an solution as easy? --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 07:51, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:We can handle them as they come up. In general, I think it's better practice to avoid reusing letters than to have to rename an existing rule.

:If we want to just do away with rule '''A''' at this point, that would be fine. It was only meant to be a starting point for brainstorming, and the rules haven't changed much lately. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 11:21, 5 November 2007 (EST)

::I Call for Judgment on this statement, this would remove the backbone rule used to define this alphabetical set of rules. We could put it outside of the rules though, like a description. --[[User:Senso|Senso]] 12:24, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:::Unless we have another rule that must start with A, why not keep it? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 12:28, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:::I like rule A, it introduces the page, please keep it --[[User:Markavian|Markavian]] 16:32, 13 November 2007 (EST)

=== B and E ===

How are B and E ''rules''? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 11:27, 7 November 2007 (EST)

:Rules? I thought the alphabet was the guide for the war against entropy [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 11:34, 7 November 2007 (EST)

::Well, the Alphabet rule does describe them as rules. But I don't really think that B and E seem out of place. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 11:37, 7 November 2007 (EST)

:They will simply be replaced by "real" rules once someone have made them. --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 14:23, 7 November 2007 (EST)

:I think of them more as "guidelines" ;) [[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 20:22, 7 November 2007 (EST)

:I put strikes through B and E and wrote more helpful ones (along the same lines) --Me
:Gravitas was a silly word. What do you think of the new rules? --[[User:Markavian|Markavian]]

:The be bold rule makes it's dramatic return! Victory! [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 19:39, 24 March 2008 (EDT)

=== Serious Rules ===

Would it be possible for us to come up with some *real* rules that are more ... serious? --[[User:Geofferic|Geofferic]] 08:59, 10 December 2007 (EST)

:The alphabet rules concept is senseless. Maybe remove the fluff? --[[User:Jackard|Jackard]] 11:09, 10 December 2007 (EST)

::Hey now, with a couple of exceptions, the rules are serious. The point of the alphabet framework wasn't random silliness; it was to inspire creativity and make rule-writing fun. It's hard to come up with good rules out of thin air. It's easier to think up a topic of concern that starts with a particular letter and then write a rule about it.

::Of course, the rules have been pretty stable for a while now, so rule A hasn't been too useful lately. There was a brief discussion a while back about dropping rule A under [[DwarfFortressWiki:Community Portal#Rule discussion]], and everybody seemed to want to keep it at the time. If you want to reopen that discussion, then I'm okay with either keeping it or dropping it (besides which, I haven't been too active around here lately anyway). --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 11:54, 10 December 2007 (EST)

:::I support the Alphabet ruleset, I don't see why it should change. It's clean and clear. --[[User:Senso|Senso]] 16:56, 10 December 2007 (EST)

::::It's childish, incomplete, unprofessional and silly. The rules are not grouped logically and there is no table of contents. There's not room for clarification or expounding and little opportunity to expand. It should be scrapped for something that makes sense. --[[User:Geofferic|Geofferic]] 03:25, 12 December 2007 (EST)

:::::It would be trivial to change it from an unordered list to use section headings, which would allow a table of contents and plenty of room for clarification. I don't think "little opportunity to expand" is valid; there's no reason we can't have multiple rules for the same letter, or rules that fall outside the alphabet rubric entirely.

:::::If you want to improve the organization, then just go for it. Let me suggest that you create the new version on a subpage at first, so that others can view two presentations side by side when discussing it. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 12:06, 12 December 2007 (EST)

:::::While I agree with some of your points, I'd like to say that this is not a "professional" wiki and silliness in general is a good thing. This is a wiki (Internet!) about a game (Haha!) that is pretty silly itself. If you want to create a Whole Complex and Indexed Body of Rules About Everything, go for it and as [[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] said, editors should be able to choose between the two. I just don't see the need. --[[User:Senso|Senso]] 14:47, 12 December 2007 (EST)

=== Ack! The ToC! The ToC with a "1.26"! ===

...why do we need section headers for each of the rules? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:52, 28 May 2008 (EDT)

=== W ===

Word-of-mouth: If you hear someone saying something new about the game, don't post it without trying it out yourself. You might have misunderstood something or your friend might have expressed him/herself wrongly. 
Something like that.--[[User:Karpatius|Karppa]] 10:33, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

:That goes in the "Rule discussion" section. *ka-move* Also, remember to not put blank lines in a comment by a single user.</offtopic>
:I don't like the rule. It discourages participation in the wiki. If they add something of questionable merit, they're supposed to use the verify template, as stated in rule V. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 11:39, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

::Will remember that in the future.
::--[[User:Karpatius|Karppa]] 02:16, 4 June 2008 (EDT)

=== W 2 ===

There are no rules about humorous content yet. I notice that references to the '''Dwarf pensioners club''' instead of '''(fortress) Guard''' have been taken out of "fact-based" articles so maybe rule W could be:

:'''Wit''' can be hard to recognise once it has been written down. It is best if it is used on clearly humour or story related pages, talk or user pages, but kept to a minimum in fact-based articles like [[Dwarf]] or [[Summer]].

This puts it "on the table" that your humour is appreciated in certain places but not in every article you contribute to. I'm not happy with my own wording but I think the intent should be there somewhere.

It could go at '''Zany''' instead because Z will be harder letter to use up!
(having said all that I personally don't object to "well done" humour even in straight-cut articles like [[Screw pump]] - the issue is my humour is incomprehensible to a lot of people and can just sound rude!)
[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 02:51, 6 July 2008 (EDT)

:I like it as '''Wit'''. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 15:09, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

::With no against comments I put in in there with a reference to {{tl|D for Dwarf}}.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 01:01, 12 July 2008 (EDT)

== Enforcing consistency in screenshots? ==

Can I strongly suggest that all screenshots be taken with the default interface and tileset, for consistency's sake? It seems to me like that would be a good way of keeping the wiki aesthetics constant. [[User:EighenIndemnis|EighenIndemnis]] 11:33, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:We can make it a rule, but we shouldn't remove any screenshots for non-conformance (except to replace them with conforming screenshots). --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 11:46, 5 November 2007 (EST)

::Yeah, for some tutorials that are written while the user is playing, it would be impossible to anyway. [[User:EighenIndemnis|EighenIndemnis]] 11:47, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:::I agree that images should use the default tileset for articles, but I disagree for personal pages or bloodline games. --[[User:Markavian|Markavian]]

::::The rule as written already exempts bloodline games. The only rule that should apply to personal pages is '''D'''. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 16:05, 5 November 2007 (EST)

Um, I added the rule before noticing the discussion here. Anyway, I added rule '''I''', inspired by the old [[Water wheel]] image ([[:Image:PerpetualMotion.JPG]]), which was incomprehesible to me and unnecessarily large. Like Peristarkawan said, the exemption of user pages is implied, but feel free to make it explicit if you want. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 16:13, 5 November 2007 (EST)

How about this?

[[Image:World_creation_screen2.png | none | frame | 400px | World creation screenshot.]]

It's clean, neat and doesn't warp the page. :) The obvious drawback is file size is not monitored. Can't we edit the file upload settings to measure pixels? Nothing over 800x600? [[User:Schm0|Schm0]] 19:16, 7 November 2007 (EST)

== Redirects and article titles ==

How do you do that thing that makes a certain term redirect to a different page? Like [[Elephants]] redirecting to [[Elephant]], for example. --[[User:BahamutZERO|BahamutZERO]] 15:20, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

:If [[Elephants]] already exists, you can move the page to [[Elephant]], and it will create the redirect for you. Otherwise, just edit [[Elephants]] to read: <nowiki>#REDIRECT [[Elephant]]</nowiki> --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 15:26, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

::I see, thanks! --[[User:BahamutZERO|BahamutZERO]] 15:27, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

:::Just FYI, if at all possible, ''do not create pages as plurals''. Use the following syntax: <nowiki>[[Elephant]]s</nowiki>: example [[Elephant]]s. --[[User:JT|JT]] 20:20, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

What about titles that are verbs? Should they be in "base-form"? Or whatever its called (my english on this level isnt the best). Example: should the title be '''Mine''' or '''Mining'''? --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 17:30, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

:Based on the Wikipedia style, titles should be nouns. So in your example it should be the gerund '''Mining''', and '''Mine''' would be the title for an article about mines. I've updated the rule to reflect this. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 17:35, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

::What about skills and professions? Should we have a '''Bone carving''' (labor preference) article and a '''Bone carver''' (skill) article, or would this be redundant? I've seen both styles linked to, but tend to think that the -ing form should redirect to the -er form. Opinions? --[[User:Mechturk|Mechturk]] 03:11, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:::Sounds good to me. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 11:21, 5 November 2007 (EST)

Btw, shouldnt all these comments be moved into [[DwarfFortressWiki talk:Community Portal|talk]]? --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 17:30, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

:Moved the account problem comments to the talk page. The rest are informative. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 13:26, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

== Tutorials ==

New players are getting bogged down by the complexity at the start of their fortresses, I think we should get some "getting started" or "surviving your first winter" type tutorials up as soon as possible. --[[User:BahamutZERO|BahamutZERO]] 16:33, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

:[[Your first fortress]] will do just that. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 11:31, 2 November 2007 (EDT) 

== Categories ==

I saw that the category [[:category:buildings]] had been added to category [[:category:world]]. I started to look for categories without parents and adding them to world to sortof have a list of every category. Is this good thinking? --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 19:19, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

:We already have a list of all categories at [[Special:Categories]], although it does include a few categories that aren't directly related to the game.
:Based upon the description of [[:Category:World]], it seems to me that most of the things that are currently in it don't really belong there. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 19:27, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

::Ok, Ill remove them from [[:category:world]]. But how often is [[Special:Categories]] updated? I dont see [[:category:furnaces]] in there. --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 20:24, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

:::[[Special:Categories]] is automatically updated by the Wiki software as soon as it detects a change. However, MediaWikis aggressively cache pages. It's also possible you're looking a client-side cached page of it. Finally, I don't see any content in that category so it's possible it's being ignored. See [[Special:Unusedcategories]] instead. --[[User:JT|JT]] 20:28, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

== Deletion ==

We now have a [[:category:deletion]], who has the power to delete pages? When are they deleted? Who make the final call? The same person that deletes them? What rules should we make regarding this? --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 11:57, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

:Anyone can mark a page for deletion using the <nowiki>{{del}}</nowiki> tag, however it is usually recommended to get a consensus that it's not worth keeping. Exceptions are things like spam or empty pages. The <nowiki>{{del}}</nowiki> tag just lets the admin know to delete it, ultimately it's his call to do so or not. Just ask around on the talk page first, if no one disagrees, add the tag. (Disclaimer: that's how it worked on the old wiki, the policy may change as this new wiki grows.) --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 13:02, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

== Water level style ==

I think we should have a standard style for talking about water level. We could say it various ways, such as "6/7 water," "water with a depth of 6," "a depth of 6 pool," or "water with a depth of six." It seems using the numeral makes it clear that we mean water depth, without adding the /7. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 13:02, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

:I'm not sure. The /7 is definately unnessessary and that we should use 6 instead of six, maybe create a template to make the numberal blue/red (water/magma)? If not "Water 6" and "Magma 5" seem short, simple, correct, and understandable.--[[User:Draco18s|Draco18s]] 03:27, 2 November 2007 (EDT)

::Like {{Raw Tile|6|#44F|#009}} / {{Raw Tile|6|#F44|#900}} or {{Raw Tile|6|#00F|#000}} / {{Raw Tile|6|#F00|#000}}? --[[User:Matryx|Matryx]] 05:38, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:::Too hard to read against the normal white background I think. But just the coloured number on its own would stand out weirdly. --[[User:Shades|Shades]] 06:10, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:::: {{Raw Tile|6|#00F|#FFF}} / {{Raw Tile|6|#F00|#FFF}} or not even going so far as to use the tile template? --[[User:Matryx|Matryx]] 06:16, 5 November 2007 (EST)

:I think "depth of 7" works wonders, bold, colored text had a bit high contrast according to my taste. In case there is either magma or water, just state it. And we should also link to a waterdepth article for those that are in need of furher explanation of the concept. Example; "a water wheel needs to be placed in flowing [[water]] with a [[water depth|depth]] of at least 3". --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 07:44, 5 November 2007 (EST)

== Templates? ==

Is there a page with a list of all the templates available to us? Are all of the templates migrated from the old wiki? --[[User:Felix the Cat|Felix the Cat]] 00:51, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

:You can find a list at [[Special:Allpages?namespace=10]]. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 01:44, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

== Forum references ==

Where there is a bit saying "Toady said this", what is the best way to link to the forum? Currently in magma, I've got a link to http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=001504 which shows up as [http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=001504] (not ''too'' bad). Is there a better way of doing it akin to Wikipedia with <ref>something</ref>? Maybe something like [[Template:version]] for future (but that doesn't cover the "this is how it works now" type thing. --[[User:Shagie|Shagie]] 02:17, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

: IIRC the <ref> system on Wikipedia requires an extension to be installed. --[[User:Rick|Rick]] 17:48, 7 November 2007 (EST)
::I know this is late but try this:
::<nowiki>[http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=001504 Caption]</nowiki>
::which shows as
::[http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=001504 Caption]
::I would use it like this:
:::"According to a [http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=001504 forum post]..."
::[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 02:41, 6 July 2008 (EDT)

== Crops categories ==

My wiki-fu is weak, but surely there is a better way to present the myriad crops than having a different category for each season and biome? [[:Category:Crops]] could at least show the seasons grouped seperate from the biomes. Are we going to put each plant in its respective biome and seasons, ''and'' in [[:Category:Crops]], or is [[List of crops]] sufficient? Just seems like there's a lot of potential for a mess here, and we need to standardize the plant pages and various categories.

Personally I like the way the old wiki did it, with some nice templates. Granted there are a lot more plants in this version, but not so much that we need 20 subcategories cluttering up the crops category. See [http://archive.dwarffortresswiki.net/index.php/Crops Crops] and [http://archive.dwarffortresswiki.net/index.php/Plump_Helmets Plump Helmets]; easy to tell what crops belong in what season. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 02:52, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

== Wealth page... ==

I've been looking for tips on building fortress wealth, and haven't really been able to find anything. Can someone who knows something about it start a [[Wealth]] page? I know that mining out areas, making things, and artifacts contribute to wealth, but that's all I know. How much does mining a square contribute? Are there other ways to build wealth? Do mined out areas have to be populated, or can I go mine away a random hill and have it count? What are the best things to make to increase value? Do items have to be placed, or just made? and so on... --[[User:Bobson|Bobson]] 16:22, 11 March 2008 (EDT)

== Formatting standards ==

=== Category tags ===

On this wiki, the standard for capitalization in category tags is <tt><nowiki>[[Category:Stub]]</nowiki></tt>. I asked what it should be, and nobody answered for two and a half months, so I feel entitled to decide it. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 12:57, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

=== Headers ===

At the current time, the standard for a header is <code>=== Headers ===</code>. <code>===Headers===</code> is slightly easier to type, is typed more often by newbies, and works just as well, but has less white space. Input? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 12:57, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

:I like <code>=== Header ===</code> better, because it's easier to read, and the extra whitespace helps call your attention to the name of the section, whereas you might glance over it as an "unrecognized token" if you didn't manage to filter out the immediately surrounding markup. I think the 2 bytes saved on whitespace is negligible and I certainly don't mind correcting them when I find 'em, if necessary. A similar question (if it's not been asked) would be whether or not to include a newline in between a heading and its text. I think for big sections of text, an extra line looks nice, but for multiple, smaller, less important sections, it's easier to manage the headings if there's no blank line separating them from the section they head. --[[User:Marble Dice|Marble Dice]] 14:18, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

::I always put a blank line above and below a header (unless it's the first line in the page), except in rare situations, like the current List of Twenty-Six Rules. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 16:40, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

=== Talk pages ===

The current standard seems to be to never put a blank line in a comment by a single users, except in highly lengthy comments, and to always put exactly one blank line between comments by different users, because that's what I say in [[Template:Newbie]], but is that correct? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 16:40, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

== Italian Wiki ==

Hi! 
I've just ask to Tarn to open an italian guide on this wiki.. so can i do it? --[[User:Marte]]

:No, this wiki is english only. You're free, however, to make an Italian DF wiki... I'm not sure how that works, though, so don't ask me. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:29, 11 August 2008 (EDT)

i need an answer about this.. who can help me?

== Wikprojects ==

Do we have wikiprojects like Wikipedia? I want to start one on making sure answers to the [http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=ff2b3eb60775033d8509fa42a227db08&board=7.0 DF gameplay questions] in the forum are in the wiki. [[User:DanielLC|DanielLC]] 15:18, 4 October 2008 (EDT)

Dwarf Fortress Wiki:Community Portal

2008-10-04T19:02:04Z

DanielLC: /* A */ Make that one rule to go.

This page is for organizing the war effort against entropy.

== We are doing this! Let us do it right. ==

=====A=====
* '''A'''lphabet: Okay, the first rule is that there must be a rule for each letter of the alphabet. Now only one rule to go. (Inspired by [[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]]'s [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nomic nomic] instincts)

=====B=====
* '''B'''e bold! So says Wikipedia. If you see a mistake, be it a fact or a typo, change it. Don't leave it to someone else to clean up mistakes. Feel free to make changes. If you think an article needs a major rewrite, then if you think you can do it, go ahead and do it. You can also use the discussion (talk) page to post suggestions.

=====C=====
* '''C'''ategories: When editing a page, stop to think about what categories it should be included in, and add them if necessary. Don't forget to consider categories that don't yet exist. Capitalize the tag like <tt><nowiki>[[Category:Stub]]</nowiki></tt>.

=====D=====
* '''D'''iscussion: Use the discussion page to voice suggestions and to ask questions. Try to limit inline comments. Before editing, check the discussion page to see if there are any changes being planned.

=====E=====
* '''E'''liminate, {{[[Template:deletion|delete]]}}, fluff. This includes redirects that aren't linked to and wouldn't be typed in the search box.

=====F=====
* '''F'''acts: Keep your information factual. If you haven't confirmed something, post it on the discussion page. Do not create one-liner pages without links (unless its a stub). Add as much pertinent information as you can and avoid conjecture (possibly, maybe, could be, likely) by providing concrete examples from the game or links to other parts of the wiki.

=====G=====
* '''G'''reed shall not be your motivation, but grace shall.

=====H=====
* '''H'''eadings: Organize the content of each page into sections of related information. After the introduction, use appropriate headings for each section, and follow the '''N'''aming style of this guide. Keep headings to a minimum, consider a list or a table if you have many repetitive facts.

=====I=====
* '''I'''mages: Images and screenshots should use the default [[tilesets]] for clarity. Small diagrams should be constructed with [[Template:RT]], for easy editing, and to save on space. Exceptions are pages ''about'' tilesets and story pages like [[:Category:Bloodline Games|bloodline games]]. Images should always be in .png format. When uploading images, give them a name that is descriptive and unlikely to be duplicated. Names like "1", "screenshot", and "untitled" should be avoided.

=====J=====
* '''J'''ealousy: Don't be shocked if someone rewrites or removes your article; your hard work is not lost. Post suggestions on the discussion page and talk about the issue. All versions are stored in the history, so your material can be reused or merged with existing content if the rewriter left something out.

=====K=====
* '''K'''eys: We have a special template, [[:Template:K|k]] (abbreviation of [[:Template:Key|key]]). This wiki is about a game that uses nearly 100% keyboard input, so we have a template to improve the display of keys. For example, the syntax <code><nowiki>{{k|q}}</nowiki></code> will generate {{k|q}}, a standardized and visually pleasing representation of the "q" key. The enter key should be done as <code><nowiki>{{k|Enter}}</nowiki></code> ( {{k|Enter}} ), for example, and the arrow keys use arrow characters, found at [[CP437|this handy code page]]. The right arrow key, for example, appears as {{k|→}}.

=====L=====
* '''L'''osing is fun! If something made you lose, include information about it. Others may want to try it out, or you may help someone avoid flooding their masterpiece fortress.

=====M=====
* '''M'''ore people should use the raw files (found in your 'install dir\raw\objects') to get information about creatures and objects. It has loads of good information, that the game actually uses.

=====N=====
* '''N'''aming: The titles of new pages should be singular nouns, with only the first word capitalized. Example: [[Screw pump]], [[Metalsmith's forge]], [[Gear assembly]]. The exceptions are terms that are always plural and proper nouns. Getting the wrong name can mean extra redirects and always means a page move. Screw pump is not the same as Screw Pump. Do not put question marks in the names of articles: Due to the way they are handled in URIs, it messes things up.

=====O=====
* '''O'''riginal research is good! Forget what you've seen on That Other Wiki; personal experience is perfectly fine here. Without original research, this wiki would be a tiny fraction of its current self--so if you see something that seems wrong, needs verification, or just lacks information, load up the current edition and check for yourself (but please, say you've done so on the talk page).

=====P=====
* '''P'''review: Use the preview button to check for typos. Avoid cluttering the history of a page with multiple edits. Mark small changes as 'minor' so they can be (optionally) hidden from the recent changes page.

=====Q=====
* '''Q'''ueue: Check the special pages for work still to be done! There are lists of [[Special:Deadendpages|Dead end pages]]. [[Special:Uncategorizedcategories|Uncategorized categories]], [[Special:DoubleRedirects|Double redirects]], [[Special:BrokenRedirects|Broken redirects]], and [[Special:Specialpages|others]] that all need work occasionally. If you feel more like writing content than maintaining the wiki, the list of [[:Category:Stub|stub pages]] is a good place for you to start, followed by the [[Special:ShortPages|short pages]] that exist.

=====R=====
* '''R'''edundancy: Before creating a new page, do a search to find out if the topic is already discussed in detail somewhere else. If you find that redundant pages already exist, merge their content and have one redirect to the other. This rule also refers to redundant material inside pages.

=====S=====
* '''S'''tyle: In general, try to follow the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style Wikipedia Manual of Style] when writing articles. For example, introduce keyword articles by highlighting the first keyword in bold, such as '''Rules'''.

=====T=====
* '''T'''imelessness: The wiki is intended as a guide for all players, even new ones. As such, references to differences from or similarities to old versions of DF should be reduced and eliminated, except on pages specifically dealing with said differences or similarities. Avoid phrases like "now marble can be used to make steel" or "before, farms required two floodgates", etc. For facts that are likely to change, or placeholder features, use [[Template:Version]]. For example, you might say, "[[Cave-in]]s are buggy right now{{version|0.27.169.33a}}" using the version template: <code><nowiki>{{version|0.27.169.33a}}</nowiki></code>.

=====U=====
* '''U'''ser pages: Introduce your self, let the community know who you are. If you have a comment on someone's actions on the wiki, praise or otherwise, post it on their talk page, and they'll get notified next time they login. However, keep this place civilized; avoid flame wars, personal attacks and insults.

=====V=====
* '''V'''erify: Many loosely based assumptions are floating around. Verify your information and check [[:Category:Articles needing further verification]] if you think you can help verify others. If you have something that is not verified, use the <code><nowiki>{{verify}}</nowiki></code> tag right after it.

=====W=====
*'''W'''it can be hard to recognise once it has been written down. It is best if it is used on clearly humour or story related pages, talk or user pages, but kept to a minimum in fact-based articles like [[Dwarf]] or [[Summer]]. Use an appropriate template such as {{tl|D for Dwarf}} if there might be confusion.

=====X=====
* '''X'''eniality: Be nice to people who are new to Dwarf Fortress.

=====Y=====
* '''Y''': ?

=====Z=====
* '''Z''': the sign of Zorro. Sign each of your 'Talk' entries with your own <nowiki>--~~~~</nowiki>.

== Notice Templates ==

There are templates available for marking pages needing improvement. Ideally, you should make appropriate changes and move on, but if you are unable to access the required information, post a notice to flag an issue up. Using template notices provides a consistent way of flagging a page. Notices in use can be tracked through category pages. Notices based on rules from this page should all use the [[:Category:Pages that break Community Portal rules]] category.

This section is far from complete.

=== Template for Notice Templates ===

{{Colored Notice Box|#0000FF|Contents of the message.
Second value is sidebar colour in HTML hex, RR GG BB, e.g. #FF0000 (red), #009900 (dark green), #0088FF, (light blue), #000000 (black)}}
<nowiki>{{Colored Notice Box|#FF00FF|Contents of the message}}</nowiki>

=== Image Rules Notice ===

{{Image Rules Notice}}
<nowiki>{{Image Rules Notice}}</nowiki>

=== New Notices ===

If several pages arise that break the same rule, create a new template based off one of the above templates. Remember to include the [[:Category:Pages that break Community Portal rules]] tag at the bottom, or some other appropriate category so that other users can track pages that need reworking. To create a new template, type <nowiki>[[Template:Rule name notice]]</nowiki> into an article, or directly into the address bar of your browser.

Dwarf Fortress Wiki:Community Portal

2008-10-04T19:00:48Z

DanielLC: /* X */

This page is for organizing the war effort against entropy.

== We are doing this! Let us do it right. ==

=====A=====
* '''A'''lphabet: Okay, the first rule is that there must be a rule for each letter of the alphabet. Now only five rules to go. (Inspired by [[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]]'s [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nomic nomic] instincts)

=====B=====
* '''B'''e bold! So says Wikipedia. If you see a mistake, be it a fact or a typo, change it. Don't leave it to someone else to clean up mistakes. Feel free to make changes. If you think an article needs a major rewrite, then if you think you can do it, go ahead and do it. You can also use the discussion (talk) page to post suggestions.

=====C=====
* '''C'''ategories: When editing a page, stop to think about what categories it should be included in, and add them if necessary. Don't forget to consider categories that don't yet exist. Capitalize the tag like <tt><nowiki>[[Category:Stub]]</nowiki></tt>.

=====D=====
* '''D'''iscussion: Use the discussion page to voice suggestions and to ask questions. Try to limit inline comments. Before editing, check the discussion page to see if there are any changes being planned.

=====E=====
* '''E'''liminate, {{[[Template:deletion|delete]]}}, fluff. This includes redirects that aren't linked to and wouldn't be typed in the search box.

=====F=====
* '''F'''acts: Keep your information factual. If you haven't confirmed something, post it on the discussion page. Do not create one-liner pages without links (unless its a stub). Add as much pertinent information as you can and avoid conjecture (possibly, maybe, could be, likely) by providing concrete examples from the game or links to other parts of the wiki.

=====G=====
* '''G'''reed shall not be your motivation, but grace shall.

=====H=====
* '''H'''eadings: Organize the content of each page into sections of related information. After the introduction, use appropriate headings for each section, and follow the '''N'''aming style of this guide. Keep headings to a minimum, consider a list or a table if you have many repetitive facts.

=====I=====
* '''I'''mages: Images and screenshots should use the default [[tilesets]] for clarity. Small diagrams should be constructed with [[Template:RT]], for easy editing, and to save on space. Exceptions are pages ''about'' tilesets and story pages like [[:Category:Bloodline Games|bloodline games]]. Images should always be in .png format. When uploading images, give them a name that is descriptive and unlikely to be duplicated. Names like "1", "screenshot", and "untitled" should be avoided.

=====J=====
* '''J'''ealousy: Don't be shocked if someone rewrites or removes your article; your hard work is not lost. Post suggestions on the discussion page and talk about the issue. All versions are stored in the history, so your material can be reused or merged with existing content if the rewriter left something out.

=====K=====
* '''K'''eys: We have a special template, [[:Template:K|k]] (abbreviation of [[:Template:Key|key]]). This wiki is about a game that uses nearly 100% keyboard input, so we have a template to improve the display of keys. For example, the syntax <code><nowiki>{{k|q}}</nowiki></code> will generate {{k|q}}, a standardized and visually pleasing representation of the "q" key. The enter key should be done as <code><nowiki>{{k|Enter}}</nowiki></code> ( {{k|Enter}} ), for example, and the arrow keys use arrow characters, found at [[CP437|this handy code page]]. The right arrow key, for example, appears as {{k|→}}.

=====L=====
* '''L'''osing is fun! If something made you lose, include information about it. Others may want to try it out, or you may help someone avoid flooding their masterpiece fortress.

=====M=====
* '''M'''ore people should use the raw files (found in your 'install dir\raw\objects') to get information about creatures and objects. It has loads of good information, that the game actually uses.

=====N=====
* '''N'''aming: The titles of new pages should be singular nouns, with only the first word capitalized. Example: [[Screw pump]], [[Metalsmith's forge]], [[Gear assembly]]. The exceptions are terms that are always plural and proper nouns. Getting the wrong name can mean extra redirects and always means a page move. Screw pump is not the same as Screw Pump. Do not put question marks in the names of articles: Due to the way they are handled in URIs, it messes things up.

=====O=====
* '''O'''riginal research is good! Forget what you've seen on That Other Wiki; personal experience is perfectly fine here. Without original research, this wiki would be a tiny fraction of its current self--so if you see something that seems wrong, needs verification, or just lacks information, load up the current edition and check for yourself (but please, say you've done so on the talk page).

=====P=====
* '''P'''review: Use the preview button to check for typos. Avoid cluttering the history of a page with multiple edits. Mark small changes as 'minor' so they can be (optionally) hidden from the recent changes page.

=====Q=====
* '''Q'''ueue: Check the special pages for work still to be done! There are lists of [[Special:Deadendpages|Dead end pages]]. [[Special:Uncategorizedcategories|Uncategorized categories]], [[Special:DoubleRedirects|Double redirects]], [[Special:BrokenRedirects|Broken redirects]], and [[Special:Specialpages|others]] that all need work occasionally. If you feel more like writing content than maintaining the wiki, the list of [[:Category:Stub|stub pages]] is a good place for you to start, followed by the [[Special:ShortPages|short pages]] that exist.

=====R=====
* '''R'''edundancy: Before creating a new page, do a search to find out if the topic is already discussed in detail somewhere else. If you find that redundant pages already exist, merge their content and have one redirect to the other. This rule also refers to redundant material inside pages.

=====S=====
* '''S'''tyle: In general, try to follow the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style Wikipedia Manual of Style] when writing articles. For example, introduce keyword articles by highlighting the first keyword in bold, such as '''Rules'''.

=====T=====
* '''T'''imelessness: The wiki is intended as a guide for all players, even new ones. As such, references to differences from or similarities to old versions of DF should be reduced and eliminated, except on pages specifically dealing with said differences or similarities. Avoid phrases like "now marble can be used to make steel" or "before, farms required two floodgates", etc. For facts that are likely to change, or placeholder features, use [[Template:Version]]. For example, you might say, "[[Cave-in]]s are buggy right now{{version|0.27.169.33a}}" using the version template: <code><nowiki>{{version|0.27.169.33a}}</nowiki></code>.

=====U=====
* '''U'''ser pages: Introduce your self, let the community know who you are. If you have a comment on someone's actions on the wiki, praise or otherwise, post it on their talk page, and they'll get notified next time they login. However, keep this place civilized; avoid flame wars, personal attacks and insults.

=====V=====
* '''V'''erify: Many loosely based assumptions are floating around. Verify your information and check [[:Category:Articles needing further verification]] if you think you can help verify others. If you have something that is not verified, use the <code><nowiki>{{verify}}</nowiki></code> tag right after it.

=====W=====
*'''W'''it can be hard to recognise once it has been written down. It is best if it is used on clearly humour or story related pages, talk or user pages, but kept to a minimum in fact-based articles like [[Dwarf]] or [[Summer]]. Use an appropriate template such as {{tl|D for Dwarf}} if there might be confusion.

=====X=====
* '''X'''eniality: Be nice to people who are new to Dwarf Fortress.

=====Y=====
* '''Y''': ?

=====Z=====
* '''Z''': the sign of Zorro. Sign each of your 'Talk' entries with your own <nowiki>--~~~~</nowiki>.

== Notice Templates ==

There are templates available for marking pages needing improvement. Ideally, you should make appropriate changes and move on, but if you are unable to access the required information, post a notice to flag an issue up. Using template notices provides a consistent way of flagging a page. Notices in use can be tracked through category pages. Notices based on rules from this page should all use the [[:Category:Pages that break Community Portal rules]] category.

This section is far from complete.

=== Template for Notice Templates ===

{{Colored Notice Box|#0000FF|Contents of the message.
Second value is sidebar colour in HTML hex, RR GG BB, e.g. #FF0000 (red), #009900 (dark green), #0088FF, (light blue), #000000 (black)}}
<nowiki>{{Colored Notice Box|#FF00FF|Contents of the message}}</nowiki>

=== Image Rules Notice ===

{{Image Rules Notice}}
<nowiki>{{Image Rules Notice}}</nowiki>

=== New Notices ===

If several pages arise that break the same rule, create a new template based off one of the above templates. Remember to include the [[:Category:Pages that break Community Portal rules]] tag at the bottom, or some other appropriate category so that other users can track pages that need reworking. To create a new template, type <nowiki>[[Template:Rule name notice]]</nowiki> into an article, or directly into the address bar of your browser.

40d Talk:Fishing

2008-10-04T18:53:56Z

DanielLC: Fishing is the labor used to catch fish.

Most of this was taken from the old wiki as it all seems applicable here. Whether or not fish can be depleted or not I do not know - at this point it seems that the turtle supply is endless.--[[User:Decanter|Decanter]] 05:03, 7 November 2007 (EST)

:I had a 'there is nothing to catch in the swamps' message a few times. so it is possible to deplete all the fish in a pond, but haven't been able to get rid of all the fish. --[[User:Soyweiser|Soyweiser]] 06:40, 7 November 2007 (EST)

Does anyone with more experience than I know what make (or made) Carp so dangerous? In 0.27.169.33a and previous, swimming creatures would gain incredible attributes due to gaining experience by swimming all the time, which would obviously make combat more dangerous. In the latest version (0.27.169.33b) though, innate swimmers no longer gain swim skill, which sounds like it would make fish rather less dangerous.--[[User:Kmgraba|Kmgraba]] 22:37, 18 November 2007 (EST)
== Useful stuff to add to article. ==

Are brooks fishable? Streams? Are swamps depleted permanently or temporarily? [[User:Runspotrun|Runspotrun]] 09:24, 13 November 2007 (EST)
:Brooks are fishable and can be depleted. Swamps, brooks and artificial underground lakes are depleted temporarily. When any biome becomes depleted - a fishing zone anywhere near the water in that biome shows that there are 0 (zero) squares suitable for fishing.
:Also of notice is that the swamp will only repopulate with turtles/whatever was there in the first time even if you connect it to brook with other fish by a channel.
:My question now is whether the amount to be fished out before depletion is correlated with the amount of tiles with water or does every biome have a fixed amount preset on map generation?--[[User:Another|Another]] 11:07, 13 November 2007 (EST)

::I'd have to say it's at least partially connected to the amount of water; I have 3 different fortresses right now and the one with the fewest lakes definitely gets depleted more commonly, and faster, than the rest of the maps. I haven't ruled out the confound of the biome itself; perhaps there is a larger amount on biomes like swamp, and they also have more water. Anyone know if making lakes larger, or making your own artificial lakes helps with depletion? -Gotthard

== Frozen rivers ==

Can you fish a frozen river / lake?[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 00:21, 6 January 2008 (EST)

== Fishing in caves ==

Is it a problem to fish in a underwater lake filled with snakemen and lizardmen?
I'd guess they could be fished and kill off the dwarf...
I kinda wanta catch em like pokemon.--[[User:Seaneat|Seaneat]] 15:33, 3 July 2008 (EDT)

== Fishing is the labor used to catch fish. ==

"Fishing is the labor used to catch fish."
This is somewhat inaccurate. When I asked on [http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=25736.0 the forum], I was told that what you catch is unrelated to the actual number of fish in the river. The river can apparently be depleted when you can see fish vermin in it. Perhaps this should be changed to saying that fishing creates raw fish. [[User:DanielLC|DanielLC]] 14:53, 4 October 2008 (EDT)