Editing 40d Talk:Flux

== Maps without flux? ==

Where might I find flux? I've been digging quite extensive shafts but have yet to hit on any at all - instead it's all shale, granite, magnetite and mica. --[[User:Theory|Theory]] 14:53, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

:Before you embark, check the map screen. It will list the different stone layers available in each biome in your selected embark area. Use F1-F8 to flip through all available biomes in your embark area, noting the stone layers in each to the right. If one of the flux stones shows up in that list in one (or more) of the biomes in your embark area, you will have that flux available. You can also tell where it will be based on the stone list and the selected biome. If it lists gabbro, then chalk, then obsidian in a biome which is in the southwest corner of your embark area, you can use that to find it. Dig into the southwest corner and pay attention to the stone type you're digging in. If you're digging in gabbro, the chalk is some z-levels below; likewise, if you're digging in obsidian, the chalk will be some z-levels above.

:If you've already embarked to an area without paying attention to that, it's very likely that you don't have any flux available; it can be rather sparse throughout the world. Still, you have a couple of options. First, you could generate another world using the same seed and find the spot you embarked to again to note the stone layers. Otherwise, you could use the Reveal.exe utility on a copy of your current world to reveal all stone layers and hunt around for some flux.
:EDIT: also, if you have no flux available on your map, you can always make a trade agreement with another civilization to have them bring you flux stone with their trade caravans. --[[User:Janus|Janus]] 22:37, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

::Can somebody confirm that flux stones should be available for trade because it seems I cannot get chalk, limestone, marble etc although I can get bituminous coal, magnetite etc.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 09:53, 13 June 2008 (EDT)

:::I trade for them all the time. It does depend on the dwarven civ you trade with, though- I know one of my dwarf civs only has one kind of flux, while another has three or four. And of course, you can only get it from the dwarven caravans. --[[User:Zombiejustice|Zombiejustice]] 10:46, 13 June 2008 (EDT)

::::I've had many maps where I could trade for flux, but I just got a map with no flux in it and no flux listed in the embark screen under stone or in the dwarven caravan's trade request list. I guess steel will have to be an import in maps like that. [[User:Psion|Psion]] 07:33, 4 August 2008 (EDT)

:::Civilisations will only bring flux if they have access to it. You can check on the world map if their cities are on Flux layers. If not, you never have access to flux.[[User:Qwertyu|Qwertyu]] 10:04, 5 March 2009 (EST)

::::I believe the stones you can bring on embark are also representative of what the civilization has available.  That is, if there's no flux available on the embark screen, then the traders won't have any.  Incidentally, the same would go for [[bauxite]] as well. --[[User:LegacyCWAL|LegacyCWAL]] 12:15, 5 March 2009 (EST)

:I've been having some trouble importing flux. The merchants are happy to bring marble blocks, but for some reason my smelters aren't giving me the option to make pig iron. Can I use blocks as a flux material, or does it have to be rough stones? I have all of the other ingredients I need so I can't think what else the problem could be. [[User:Aosher|Aosher]] 04:56, 5 March 2009 (EST)

:: Blocks can not be used as flux AFAIR, you need the real stones.[[User:Qwertyu|Qwertyu]] 10:04, 5 March 2009 (EST)

:::I'm pretty sure that you are correct: you need raw stones, not blocks.  FWIW, [[modding]] can provide ways to counteract the problem of only being able to get blocks from the traders and not the raw stones. --[[User:LegacyCWAL|LegacyCWAL]] 12:15, 5 March 2009 (EST)

::::If you can only trade for flux if you mod the game, then shouldn't that be noted in the article? At the moment ti's slightly misleading. [[User:Aosher|Aosher]] 05:48, 6 March 2009 (EST)

:::::i had the same problem; asked for chalk blocks from the caravan, traded for chalk blocks, and found myself lacking the 'make pig iron' option. fortunately, i've asked for some chalk stones (not blocks - it is possible. check the 'materials' tab, i think, when the liaison appears) from the next dwarven caravan - let's see if they're delivered :D <small>&ndash; [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:DJDevil|DJDevil]]</small>
:::::also, it should be stated that blocks cant be used as flux on the flux page; anyone wanna edit it? x] <small>&ndash; [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:DJDevil|DJDevil]]</small>

::::::For the record, I do not believe that "this can be changed by modding" should be in ''any'' article except for the most dire of bugs and oversights.  Otherwise, we would have to say as much on a very, VERY large number of pages despite it being completely irrelevant to the unmodded game. --[[User:LegacyCWAL|LegacyCWAL]] 12:20, 6 March 2009 (EST)

:::::::Seconded. You mod at your own risk. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 12:50, 6 March 2009 (EST)

:::::yeah, they brought some flux stone (the caravans after i asked 'em). all 8 pieces, lol. two of each, minus dolomite. they even brought a (yes, singular) lignite block (so i'm not sure if it can be used), but it was only 5! :D<br>how do you get them to bring more? put it to the highest priority in the negotiations thing? all i asked for was chalk and some meat! :/  --[[User:DJ Devil|DJ Devil]]

== Flux Capacitor? ==

So dwarves will be able to travel back in time? In a DeLorean? --[[User:AlexFili|AlexFili]] 05:59, 16 June 2008 (EDT)
:Yes, but you have to generate 1.21 Gigawatts with windmills and water wheels.
My Niggling doubt says otherwise
@@ Line 8: / Line 8: @@
 :EDIT: also, if you have no flux available on your map, you can always make a trade agreement with another civilization to have them bring you flux stone with their trade caravans. --[[User:Janus|Janus]] 22:37, 10 March 2008 (EDT)
-== Trading for Flux ==
+::Can somebody confirm that flux stones should be available for trade because it seems I cannot get chalk, limestone, marble etc although I can get bituminous coal, magnetite etc.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 09:53, 13 June 2008 (EDT)
-Can somebody confirm that flux stones should be available for trade because it seems I cannot get chalk, limestone, marble etc although I can get bituminous coal, magnetite etc.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 09:53, 13 June 2008 (EDT)
-:I trade for them all the time. It does depend on the dwarven civ you trade with, though- I know one of my dwarf civs only has one kind of flux, while another has three or four. And of course, you can only get it from the dwarven caravans. --[[User:Zombiejustice|Zombiejustice]] 10:46, 13 June 2008 (EDT)
+:::I trade for them all the time. It does depend on the dwarven civ you trade with, though- I know one of my dwarf civs only has one kind of flux, while another has three or four. And of course, you can only get it from the dwarven caravans. --[[User:Zombiejustice|Zombiejustice]] 10:46, 13 June 2008 (EDT)
-::I've had many maps where I could trade for flux, but I just got a map with no flux in it and no flux listed in the embark screen under stone or in the dwarven caravan's trade request list. I guess steel will have to be an import in maps like that. [[User:Psion|Psion]] 07:33, 4 August 2008 (EDT)
+::::I've had many maps where I could trade for flux, but I just got a map with no flux in it and no flux listed in the embark screen under stone or in the dwarven caravan's trade request list. I guess steel will have to be an import in maps like that. [[User:Psion|Psion]] 07:33, 4 August 2008 (EDT)
 :::Civilisations will only bring flux if they have access to it. You can check on the world map if their cities are on Flux layers. If not, you never have access to flux.[[User:Qwertyu|Qwertyu]] 10:04, 5 March 2009 (EST)
 ::::I believe the stones you can bring on embark are also representative of what the civilization has available.  That is, if there's no flux available on the embark screen, then the traders won't have any.  Incidentally, the same would go for [[bauxite]] as well. --[[User:LegacyCWAL|LegacyCWAL]] 12:15, 5 March 2009 (EST)
- If you are able to take flux stone at [[embark]], <br />you will be able to request it from the [[caravan]]...
-I'm not convinced this is a perfectly true statement of the facts.  First, if there is more than one dwarf civ to choose from, yours might not have flux while the Trader's does - that much is clear.  But regarding the above statement - are we sure it doesn't work the other way as well, that some Traders might ''not'' have flux if the civ you chose does?  --[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 21:02, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
-:Odd. I was under the impression that the dwarven caravan was always from your own civilisation. I've yet to notice a mismatch between what I could bring and what the traders had, but I'll admit I wasn't watching everything - just specific things(like coal). --[[User:Shurhaian|Shurhaian]]
-::It was my impression that it could differ, but I could easily be wrong - like you, I haven't made notes on every detail.  Pain in the ass to research, since it requires a 2 1/2 season diff between embark and the liaison.--[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 21:29, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
-:::This is the first time I have heard anyone suggest it could differ. The last many times I have embarked (I can be somewhat perfectionistic so I abandon quite a bit) the resources for trade have been consistent with the ones for embark, and the times I have bothered to check the civ name has been too. I don't actually know for a fact that this is always the case, but I am under the impression that it is considered a fact. --[[User:Nahno|Nahno]] 12:26, 8 September 2009 (UTC)
-::::Indeed. Given that you can eventually become the Mountainhome for your respective civilisation, and also considering the liaison's greeting, it just makes sense that you trade with your own civilisation. Which is also part of why they never declare war with you, isn't it? Unless you posit that the dwarves have never, ever, ever known intraracial wars - at which point why even have multiple civilisations? ...Seriously, though, also consider: the liaison stops showing up as soon as you have the king/queen at your fortress. If it were from a different civilisation, you'd think it MORE important, not less, to send an emissary. --[[User:Shurhaian|Shurhaian]]
-==flux blocks==
 :I've been having some trouble importing flux. The merchants are happy to bring marble blocks, but for some reason my smelters aren't giving me the option to make pig iron. Can I use blocks as a flux material, or does it have to be rough stones? I have all of the other ingredients I need so I can't think what else the problem could be. [[User:Aosher|Aosher]] 04:56, 5 March 2009 (EST)
@@ Line 47: / Line 34: @@
 :::::yeah, they brought some flux stone (the caravans after i asked 'em). all 8 pieces, lol. two of each, minus dolomite. they even brought a (yes, singular) lignite block (so i'm not sure if it can be used), but it was only 5! :D<br>how do you get them to bring more? put it to the highest priority in the negotiations thing? all i asked for was chalk and some meat! :/  --[[User:DJ Devil|DJ Devil]]
-::::::I often started on maps without flux, and as far as I know, the traders never bring many stones. There are some ways to go around the problem, though. First of all, you should keep in mind that there is very little use in steel items. A fully clad platemail dwarf needs ten bars, and iron is almost as good as steel (definitely enough for "light infantry"). When starting a new fort, you can therefore try to take a lot of flux with you, as it is relatively cheap (6 points). Furthermore, you can trade with the caravan for steal items and melt them down. This is most often no problem, since you output tons of trade goods after 1-2 years. Finally, you can order steel bars and pig iron bars with highest priority, which might give less flux, but should always be a net gain. Humans can also bring pig iron bars.[[User:Qwertyu|Qwertyu]] 17:13, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
-:::::i ended up doing just that; trading for all their 'steel harps' and such, and melting them down. same as asking for flux, they only brought a bar of steel with them. yep, just one, lol. handed over a few bins filled with narrow/small/large stuff from a couple of sieges, and they left happy :]  --[[User:DJ Devil|DJ Devil]]
-::::::(A max suit of armor is '''12 bars''', 13 if you count the weapon.  That's a layered cap (1) plus chain (2), plate (3) and greaves (2) for 8, plus 1 each for helm, gauntlet, boots and shield for an even dozen.  And while a steel weapon is not mandatory ''(because a champion/hero tends to kill/dismember on one shot with most '''any''' weapon)'', armor to keep dwarves alive - especially during sparing - is far more critical.  I'd want at least 4/dwarf for plate plus helm, 7 for chain plus cap would be even better, but it's all personal pref.)--[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 21:02, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
 == Flux Capacitor? ==
@@ Line 59: / Line 40: @@
 :Yes, but you have to generate 1.21 Gigawatts with windmills and water wheels.
 My Niggling doubt says otherwise
-::They will when your dwarven calendar reaches 1985. But no till then.<font face="FixedSys" color="#00FFFF">[[User:GarrieIrons|Gar]]</font>[[User Talk:GarrieIrons|rie]] 11:40, 24 July 2009 (UTC)